Open Carry, Part II: Confessions of a 2nd Amendment “Butter”
mysanantonio.com
Recently I wrote an essay titled “Please, Open Carriers, Stop ‘Defending my Rights’” (https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2014/07/06/please-open-carriers-stop-defending-my-rights/comment-page-2/). In it I explained that I’m a 2nd Amendment supporter, and that I think it’s absolutely ridiculous for so-called “gun rights activists” to open carry AKs and ARs into private businesses, especially if they’re carrying at the combat ready (what I call “Stupid Carry”). I gave good reasons why OCing a rifle into Chipotle or Starbucks creates enemies of the 2nd Amendment, rather than gaining support.
It was the most successful essay I’ve ever written. 55,000 people read it in one day. It’s been shared on many gun forums, Facebook pages, and Twitter feeds. Numerous 2nd Amendment supporters agreed with me. Of course many others didn’t, and made sure I knew they didn’t.
You are a sellout, plain and simple. Just another spineless Repugnicunt. Please Sunshine Patriot. Fuck off.
the second amendment was put in place to fight off a tyrannical government and thats it, not hunting not sporting to protect people liberty the constitution its self when you dont have a means of doing that your dead already you no marine guy tell you combat buddys share your posts with your unit they would give you a blanket party every night your a disgrace to everyman and women whos ever wore that uniform.
2A is the right to bear arms, period. You butters who judge who, what, where, and how are playing right into the MDA’s hands. Legal carry is legal carry. Grow a set or STFU.
You people bashing your fellow gun owners are ignorant cowards. They are exercising their rights, either get behind them or stop talking like you support the 2nd amendment. The hypocrisy and PC bullshit from you supposed patriots is pathetic.
According to these guys, if you don’t support open carrying a rifle into Chipotle you’re a “butter”, which is a person who says “I support the 2nd Amendment but…”. I guess I’m one of the worst butters, since I’ve been so vocal about the blatant stupidity of walking into Chipotle with an AK. And I do say, “I support the 2nd Amendment, BUT I think you’re a moron if you walk into Chipotle with an AK at the combat ready.”
I find the whole “butter” thing pretty amusing. Don’t get me wrong, I understand the principle; we’ve heard many elected representatives say stupid things like “I support the 2nd Amendment for hunting. But I don’t see a reason to own an assault rifle.” Those people don’t understand what the 2A is for. It’s not about hunting, it’s about the citizens’ right to resist tyranny. In fact, since Newtown I’ve written several essays about the importance of the 2A.
These are about how armed citizens and armed teachers can deter and defeat active shooters.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2012/12/17/cowards-mass-murders-and-the-american-public/
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/09/03/everything-thats-wrong-with-the-argument-against-protecting-schools-with-guns/
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/12/19/80-seconds-of-wisdom-about-school-shooters/
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2012/12/31/unarmed-teachers-and-our-addiction-to-failure/
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/08/27/an-unarmed-woman-stops-an-active-shooter-what-that-means-and-what-it-doesnt/
This one is about the importance of keeping military weapons in civilian hands as a means to resist tyranny.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/02/12/weapons-of-war/
This essay is about an experience I had when I was a UN police officer in Kosovo, where I failed to stop other officers from stomping on people’s rights. This experience, probably more than any other, proved to me how important the 2nd Amendment is.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/01/15/my-life-as-a-tyrant/
This one is about how ignorant of reality many gun control supporters are.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/01/28/seven-rounds/
This is about the failure of gun control at its most fundamental level.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2012/12/24/gun-control-making-a-statement-not-an-impact/
This essay is about how deadly force can be justified even against unarmed criminals.
https://chrishernandezauthor.com/2013/11/21/a-loudmouth-female-police-cadet-trayvon-martin-and-the-knockout-game/
In addition to writing about the importance of the 2nd Amendment for the last year and a half, I’ve been shooting and collecting weapons for thirty years. I’ve been a vocal gun rights supporter and opponent of gun control my entire adult life. As a cop I’ve strongly advocated citizens’ right to carry. As a soldier I’ve gone to war twice to defend our rights. But I think carrying an AR into a restaurant in a combat-ready hold is a stupid act that’s guaranteed to create enemies.
Since Newtown, the 2nd Amendment has been under incessant attack. When a grinning, shades-wearing OC activist poses like an immature child with his SKS ready to fire inside Chipotle, the anti-gun side screams “Look at this dangerous killer! This is why we need to ban guns!” And much of America agrees. Which leads to a greater likelihood of new gun restrictions. So this is probably nuts, but I kinda think we shouldn’t give more ammunition to the people who desperately want to disarm us.
But if I criticize Mr. Shades, I’m a “butter”. Well then, I guess I am. And I don’t care that the extremist, fringe, “If you disagree with me about anything you’re a traitor” crowd considers me a “butter”.
And anyway, I have my own opinions about the radical OC crowd. I think they’re living out a fantasy where they’re the righteous dragonslayers, bravely defending our rights while all other, lesser humans cower in terror. I suspect they surround themselves with likeminded friends who constantly reinforce their “us versus them” bunker mentality. And they’re pretty loose with who counts as “them”. They don’t only oppose the anti-gun side, they’ve even labeled many gun rights supporters enemies for not being sufficiently radical.
And some of them really think they’re at the forefront of a holy crusade. Some pretty interesting comments to my essay were from OC activists who compared their actions to the Civil Rights Movement.
…But if you want to defuse the argument further its really simple. All rights movements were ‘scary’ ‘offensive’ ‘stupid’ ‘wrong’ at the time, look at slavery, women’s suffrage, civil rights, and gay rights….And oh how scary and offensive it must have been when the blacks sat down in the white cafe!
How long have you supported Jim Crow laws, Mr. Hernandez?
Yes, because carrying an AK in Chipotle is no different than blacks risking being beaten and arrested for sitting at whites-only counters. Gosh, those open carriers are so courageous to risk nothing by carrying weapons into places where they’re not threatened.
But civil rights comparisons weren’t the best comments. One guy made a weird comparison between the OC movement and resistance to the Holocaust.
First they came for the long gun open carriers, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a long gun open carrier.
Then they came for the pistol open carriers, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a pistol open carrier.
Then they came for the concealed carriers, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a concealed carrier.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.
A longtime reader of my blog sent me an interesting essay which I think explains the psychology behind the extreme “I’m going to walk into Chili’s with an AK in a combat ready hold and if you think I’m wrong you’re a traitor!” group. Basically, they don’t care how their actions make them look. They don’t care that multiple, huge media outlets use their actions to smear the entire gun rights movement. They don’t care that many gun rights supporters are publicly saying “Please stop this, you’re hurting the gun rights movement!”
The writer of this essay, Lee Harris, was a Vietnam War protestor in the 60’s. His goal was to force a change to policy that would end the war, and he opposed anything that would create enemies of the anti-war movement. His friend, however, was going to participate in a massive, disruptive anti-war protest designed specifically to cause problems for the general public.
“My friend did not disagree with me as to the likely counterproductive effects of such a demonstration. Instead, he argued that this simply did not matter. His answer was that even if it was counterproductive, even if it turned people against war protesters, indeed even if it made them more likely to support the continuation of the war, he would still participate in the demonstration and he would do so for one simple reason — because it was, in his words, good for his soul.
What I saw as a political act was not, for my friend, any such thing. It was not aimed at altering the minds of other people or persuading them to act differently. Its whole point was what it did for him.
…The protest for him was not politics, but theater; and the significance of his role lay not in the political ends his actions might achieve, but rather in their symbolic value as ritual. In short, he was acting out a fantasy.”
http://denbeste.nu/external/Harris01.html
And the “I’m doing the lord’s work and you all are cowards” fantasy isn’t the only one these guys indulge in. Many of them cherish the fantastical belief that there is nothing threatening about carrying a rifle in public in a combat ready hold.
…the picture of the two standing in Chipotle “rifle at the ready” was taken by a customer wanting a cool picture, he had the safety knowledge to keep his finger off the trigger because realistically, that’s the only way the firearm will go off.
…[You’re] showing pictures of some guys with guns on their chest saying its threatening. I see nothing of the sort. Until I see a head down on the sight plane, gun in hands ready to engage, then I see no combat or combat ready posture.
So according to these guys, unless someone is actually pointing a weapon at you and pulling the trigger, there’s no threat. I find that humorous. Comparing that to pistol carry, I guess a guy walking around a restaurant with a pistol in a combat ready hold isn’t threatening either. If you saw me in Chili’s with my pistol in Sul, you’d have no reason to worry at all! I mean, my eyes aren’t on the sights, right?
What? You think there’s something threatening about me walking around a restaurant with my pistol in a combat ready hold? Hoplophobe! Anti-gunner! Butter!
Then again, since I can punch out and engage from this position in less than a second, maybe it is kinda threatening. Just like, oh, walking around Chipotle with my rifle combat ready is kinda threatening. I bet most OC activists would freak if a bunch of cops walked up to them with their pistols unholstered. But OC activists insist they’re not being threatening when they carry like that, and that only peoples’ irrational fear of guns would make them scared. Some of them like to accuse anyone who opposes stupid open carry of being scared of guns.
I guess that applies. I’m terrified of guns. Just hearing the word “gun” makes me wet my pants. Here’s proof that I’m scared of guns.
That’s me being scared of my M4 in Afghanistan.
That’s me being double scared in Iraq. Not only was an M4 up front, but a .50 was mounted above me.
That’s me screaming in terror as I fire my pistol from my back.
That’s me being horrified of my personal M4 at a training course. The instructor is using a stick to make my carbine malfunction because he’s terrified of guns too.
I got tired of only being scared of ARs, so I decided to be scared of AKs too.
Here’s me teaching a friend to be scared of guns.
Here I am firing a carbine with my eyes closed because I’m just so terrified.
This is right after I came home from Iraq. I missed being terrified of all the M4s in Iraq, so I bought one to be scared of at home.
In this one I’m firing a suppressed French sniper rifle. I needed the suppressor because I shrieked like a little girl every time the gun made a big loud bang.
In these I’m being scared of my M14. Oh, and of the numerous AK-47s the Taliban were shooting at me at the time.
So, sure, I just oppose Stupid Carry because I’m scared of guns. Right. There’s no other possible explanation.
Or maybe seeing a bunch of yahoos walking around a restaurant carrying military weapons which are specifically designed to kill people quickly and efficiently is kinda scary to Joe Regular Guy. Maybe it’s scary because said yahoos carry them ready to engage. Should I blame Joe for getting nervous when Shades walks into Chipotle posing with his SKS? Call me crazy, but I just don’t see Joe as unreasonable for wanting to eat dinner with his family without complete strangers wandering around showing off weapons designed to kill people real fast.
And before you OCers start screaming “Hoplophobe! You’re scared of an inanimate object!”, calm down and answer this questions: why do YOU want military rifles? Is it because they’re completely non-threatening? Or is it because they’re powerful tools that give you the means to resist tyrannical force? I’d guess that you want them for the same reason I do, because it gives me means to resist. Doesn’t “means to resist” equal “power to kill”?
And who cares if it’s inanimate? An axe is inanimate, but if some joker walks into Chipotle with an axe over his head, yeah, I’d get nervous. If some clown walks in with an inanimate samurai sword in a special two-handed decapitating hold, yup, I’m going to prepare for a shooting. And if some “gun rights activist” hits the salad bar with an inanimate AK-47 in a combat hold, yes I’m going to keep one eye on that guy and one hand on my pistol.
Now, go right ahead and tell each other “That Chris Hernandez guy is a coward. He’s afraid of guns.” Prop each other up. Stroke each others’ egos. Cause you’re right, I’m oh-so-scared, while you’re so brave. I’ve only carried my weapons into foreign lands where thousands of people wanted to kill me. I’ve been shot at. I came damn close to being hit. Other around me did get hit.
Which means nothing, of course. I oppose Stupid Carry, so I’m a coward. You, on the other hand, have carried your weapons into Chipotle, where dozens of regular, unarmed people posed no threat to you at all.
How brave of you.
You want to do something that’s actually brave? Take responsibility for your actions. Admit that your desperate quest for attention gave the anti-gun side the equivalent of a neverending ammo belt to use against us. Stop blaming Moms Demand Action and Bloomberg for using your pictures as “propaganda”. You posed for those pictures yourself. All MDA did was use your own stupid actions against you. Stop blaming “gun snobs” for looking down on you. Other gun owners are looking down on you because you’re doing stupid crap that hurts the 2nd Amendment, not because they’re snobs. Stop hypocritically saying “It’s wrong to criticize the way someone exercises their 2nd Amendment rights” while simultaneously screaming “How dare you use your 1st Amendment rights to criticize me!” Stop contradicting yourselves by saying “carrying a rifle into Chili’s makes perfect sense!” and then saying “we’re only carrying rifles into Chili’s to show how ridiculous it is that we can open carry rifles but not pistols.”
Tell you what, if open carrying a rifle makes so much sense, do it when you’re by yourself. Don’t only do it when you’ve got 50 other guys with rifles to back you up. Walk into Chipotle by yourself, with your rifle in a combat ready hold. See what happens. Let us know how it works out for you.
Someday, if you guys ever grow up, you might realize you don’t own the 2nd Amendment. Just as the Westboro Baptist Church doesn’t get to decide who “real” Christians are, you don’t determine who real 2A supporters are. I don’t have to prove my loyalty to you. No matter how many guns you carry into Target, you’re not the scariest people I’ve ever dealt with. You won’t frighten me into agreeing with you.
Liberals tell me I have to be a democrat because I’m Hispanic. Bullshit. Conservatives tell me I should be republican because I’m a veteran. Bullshit. Now you “gun rights activists” have created your own “you either support my right to stupidly pose with my SKS in Chipotle or you’re a butter” litmus test. You think you can intimidate all of us into falling in line with your extremism. You think I’m supposed to fall to me knees and beg you, “No, please don’t call me a butter! I’ll carry my M4 into Chipotle, I promise!”
Bullshit.
In my very pro-2A world, extremists don’t speak for the rest of us. We didn’t give radicals keys to drive the pro-2A bus. The clowns giving ammo to MDA, Bloomberg, Jon Stewart and a host of liberal media outlets don’t represent me. In the country I fought for, nobody has the standing to tell me “You must think the same way I do.”
I can determine for myself what the 2A means. And I think I understand it much better than the guys wandering around Chipotle with AKs.
http://www.amazon.com/Line-Valley-Chris-Hernandez-ebook/dp/B00HW1MA2G/ref=cm_cr_pr_product_top
http://www.amazon.com/Proof-Our-Resolve-Chris-Hernandez-ebook/dp/B0099XMR1E/ref=pd_sim_kstore_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=0FJFCDRKEX3JMWKS1NKM
Filed under: 2nd Amendment | 37 Comments
Tags: 2nd amendment, open carry texas, veteran writers
chrishernandezauthor 
First off…I’m more than a bit jealous of your operator scruff. Bro, you do operate.
I reckon I’m a Butter too, because unless I’m helping Pops on the farm and it’s some what convenient to open carry, the only time I carry uncased is if I’m in a duck blind somewhere.
But you know, I guess that means I’m anti-2A despite being an NRA Instructor, NRA Life Member, and yearly donor to the SAF.
Good write up, Chris.
The OC guys are the biggest bunch of idiots this side of MDA.
No operators here! I just got lucky and was in a job where I could grow a beard.
Thanks for the support, Mack.
Chris,
1. If your awesome wife ever kicks your butt to the curb, come find me
2. Do you, in the meantime, since 1 will never happen, have a single, older brother available? Have h I’m look me up
3. In the event that 2 isn’t an option, I need a nice single career military man, with cajones and an outlook on life similar to yours…..ah, for an intelligent man in a world of stupidity
I have and am reading your posts with great delight and joy….thanks and keep up the good work…
Thanks Karla. I don’t think my wife will ditch me anytime soon though. Every time she tries to leave me, I just get her pregnant again. And she doesn’t want to be stuck raising all those kids alone. 🙂
Hear hear.
Thanks FK.
Using the criteria of the more vocal OC groups, I guess I’m a butter too. Come to think of it, most of the folks I met during my 21 years in the military would be considered a butter.
Chris – I share you views on the subject and you definitely expressed them more eloquently than I ever could. Good Job!!
Thanks Charlie, and thanks for your service.
Chris,
I agree with you that those who are engage in stupid carry (good term) for attention are hurting our cause.
However, I think there is a big difference between that and those who engage in lawful open carry of holstered handguns politically (as in as part of a political rally, not at Chipotle) and to ensure that Law Enforcement will actually respect their rights.
This is, of course, more effective when open carriers respond to improper conduct by LEO by educating the officer and/or department of the current state of the law, filing lawsuits, and lobbying their representatives to pass new laws.
As a layman conlaw nerd, I’ve been fascinated by watching both Heller and it’s progeny wind their way through the federal court system and by watching local activist calmly, respectfully, and peacefully stand up for their rights on the street and in the courthouse. This, it seems to me, is a fine example of a citizen’s movement acting to protect and expand legal recognition of their rights.
I’m curious as to what your thoughts, as police officer and 2nd amendment supporter, about the proper tactics and limits of citizen activism when confronted by a officer who is illegally detaining and/or disarming an armed citizen. Just to be clear, I’m speaking of tactics for ensuring gun toter’s rights are respected, not for engaging in physical confrontations with LEO, even when the LEO is legally in the wrong and self defense could be legally justified.
Nick,
Well said. In the past I’ve written that I generally oppose pistol OC on mostly tactical grounds, but I don’t put pistol OC in the same class as these particular rifle OCers.
I’m short on time now, but I’ll respond to the rest of your comment later. Thanks Nick.
Okay, I have time now. I don’t know the perfect thing to do in the cases you’re describing. I know in Texas the law says you’re not allowed to resist even an unlawful arrest, unless the officer is using excessive force. There’s a good reason for that: in my experience, about half the people we arrest are certain they’re being unlawfully arrested. Even if they just beat the crap out of their wife, even if they were driving so drunk they passed out and ran off the road, even if, as in a case an instructor was involved in, a suspect shot his brother in front of the officer. Plenty of cops need to brush up on criminal law, but a larger percentage of the public misunderstands it. When someone is positive that “you have to have a warrant just to be in my front yard”, as a guy told me once, you can see why most states don’t tell people “It’s okay to resist if the officer is wrong for arresting you.” So in the case of an OCer being wrongly detained or arrested, I’d guess the best thing to do is cooperate and seek redress in court. The other option, resistance (which I know you’re not advocating) won’t work out in anyone’s favor. Cooperation and legal redress works best, just as it did with the case where officers arrested a man for breaking a stupid “homosexual conduct” law inside the man’s own home. Cooperation and legal redress not only got the charge dropped, but also got the law removed from the books.
Hope that answers your question.
“Stupid carry.” Nice one. I’ve also heard this called “carrying at people” which gets the distinction across nicely.
So I’m a Butter too. I feel bad for the good guys on the OC side of the fence. There’s good work to do there but the impression is the radicals are running the show.
If you can OC without scarring people more power to ya. If you carry at people, don’t be surprised when they come back at you with the same level of antagonism.
A,
“Carrying at people” is a good way to describe it, thanks. I agree that there are good people in the OC movement, but at the moment it looks like loonies are driving the OC bus, to the good people’s detriment.
You look positively terrified, and almost resemble a bearded Rick Moranis in one of those M-14 pictures. Heh.
Rick Moranis is hot!
Chris,
I see a tremendous difference between someone simply being armed in public and the ready-to-fire carry we are seeing in these publicity stunts.
If I’m a store owner and a man walks into my store with a pistol in a holster on his hip, thats a customer, however, if he walks in holding a pistol (whether in SUL or pointing it) thats a Robbery in Progress. In the first instance I ask if I can help him, in the second I’m putting steel on target till he’s down!
The same holds true for long guns. A person walks in with a long gun slung over the shoulder (like the pics we see of Israeli soldiers, male and female ordering ice cream) that makes them a customer. The same person walking in with an AR with magazine inserted and in a firing grip (regardless of trigger finger placement) is about to shoot someone and just became a target. Finger placement just demonstrates that the armed person has had some firearms training, not his threat level.
So then the question becomes, if an OC demonstrater gets shot while in a business demonstrating his firing grip, who gets blamed? If he can speak afterward, the OC guy will be shouting about how his rights were violated and he didn’t intend any harm. If the store owner (or a bystander) shoots the OC guy believing he is about to commit a violent felony, in my state he’s probably covered on his use of deadly force. In fact, Arkansas law (and court rulings) take the position that pointing an unloaded firearm at a crowd of people is an Aggravated Assault (felony) on each member of the crowd and that the reasonable person must assume the firearm is loaded and functional.
Eventually we will see that scenario play out somewhere. The most likely one will have a stor-owner or bystander confronting the OC guy at gunpoint while ordering him to drop his weapon. The logical outcome is that the OC guy either points his weapon in turn or decides to argue with the store owner. In either case, shots are probably fired, underwear is soiled, and the hoplophobes have a field day.
Hope I’m wrong. Keep putting out the good word and stay safe,
Scott
Thanks Scott. I don’t think we’ll have the OCer/store owner confrontation, because most of these guys know better than to OC a rifle alone (although I did hear of one case where a guy walked into a restaurant alone carrying an AK). But if it did happen, I think you’d have a hell of a hard time finding a jury willing to convict a store owner for shooting a guy who was carrying his weapon in a combat ready hold.
The long-gun Stupid OCers are the heroes of their own inner fantasies, and your cogently expressed common sense threatens their cherished delusions.
Of course they’re going to start flinging themselves against their monkey cages, and then start hurling feces. It’s the exact same thing they do when they OC long guns with Cankles and Shades at Chipotle, and for precisely the same reasons. They need the fantasy, and they need the drama to self-validate their own existence.
Free speech is a fine thing. Try using the “Delete” key, and encourage them to stand up publicly and non-anonymously for this asstarded notion on their own sites and their own two hind legs.
Typically, almost all such support disappears like morning fog on a hot day at that approach, and the rest resembles someone that you’d find climbing out of Volkswagen at a circus.
Great for laughs; but as a role model, not so much.
Actual 2d A. activism looks like lawyer Alan Gura, who with the Palmer decision in DC has now done more for 2d A. rights than all of the long-gun OC @$$clowns combined, from the dawn of the republic to now.
Thanks for fisking their nonsense, but please, don’t take it to heart.
You’ll never convert the crazy people, because they’re crazy.
And the only team they’re on is Team Insanity.
It’s like the whackjob in the asylum scene in The Big Red One when he gets his hands on an MP-40, screaming “I am one of you!” and shooting everywhere.
Uh, not.
Thanks Aesop. I know I won’t change all their minds, but maybe one or two will come to their senses and say, “Wait, this is getting really stupid. I need to part company with these guys.”
And that was a great scene in The Big Red One, wasn’t it?
Reckon some of the most obnoxious parts of the OC bunch are agents provocateurs happily trying to make the Second Amendment and it’s defenders look bad. The others are useful idiots. One part of the OC crowd is making the helpful ones look bad. Think Scott’s post was spot on.
Les,
I think that’s wishful thinking. There’s no evidence to suggest any OCers are actually working for the other side. The other side wouldn’t need to provide people to falsely stupid carry, because plenty of zealots are willing to honestly stupid carry.
You’d think the OC zealots would look at all the gun rights supporters who are publicly saying they think this is a plan by gun control supporters to make us look bad, and say to themselves, “Maybe we should stop doing this.”
@Scott: I agree with your observations and would feel comfortable in your store. Seems perfectly reasonable to me and that means I’d feel safe there.
In general, I put the Stupid Carriers in the same category as those who espouse “Zero Tolerance” rules. Just take a position and when the line is crossed, you don’t have to think about it (LAZY!) or make a decision. The decision was made beforehand when ZT was declared and there is no consideration of circumstances — the line was crossed and there is hell to pay. (Pistol shaped sandwiches, anyone?) (Bullet pendants at TSA, perhaps?)
Only difference is that in the case of ZT folks, it is someone else who crossed the line. In the case of SCers, it is they who cross the line of socially acceptable behavior and they will consider nothing other than the fact that they intended to do so, they did so, and that is that. Neither group wants to employ thinking skills or discussion skills.
So, Chris, I guess you must be all those bad things they say you are. Zero Tolerance. No discussion. No evidence to the contrary accepted or considered. Well, in THEIR minds, and I’m afraid none of us are going to make much of a difference in changing them.
I’ve never seen any of those folks in person, just online in photographs. I have to believe if I ever do come across such I’ll not laugh, which in fact would probably be my momentary initial reaction. I hope my real reaction will be more controlled in view of the damage they do to so many others. It’s really a shame.
Bob,
Good comparison. At both ends of the scale, zealotry equals “brain off, don’t think, just do as I say.”
Well, I don’t want to be a “butter”, so I will amend my comments to say “I support the Second Amendment AND I think the referenced clowns are narcissistic douche bags. There. All better now! “Ander” sounds so much classier, don’t you think?
As far as the “what to do when dealing Officer Notsofriendly “, I fall back on the method taught to me at a young age by my late father:”On the side of the road it’s all ‘Yes Sir’ and ‘No sir’. If he’s in the wrong we’ll ream him a new one in court.”
Good post, as always sir. Hope you’ve recovered from the trauma of close exposure to those scawy guns!
Awesome as always Chris,
i never understood and probably never will, those kind of OC,
As you know, i’m not a big fan of 2A but even if i don t like it, i totally understand its interrest in the US.
If i were an US citizen/resident i will probably CC, and why not OC while trecking in the wild but that s it.
I’m not afraid of guns (except maybe my Famas cause i don t want to loose it) but seeing a random person in a crowdy area with a firearm or a knife in a combat ready position, and i dont know how would i react…
And it s a shame to admit it, but my reaction will be influenced by lots of things (does this guy/girl looks happy, can i see spare mags? a Body armor? is it winter time and he has a hood or some mask to cover his face? 1/3 of my friends are muslims but if i see a guy with an AK in a combat ready position with traditional muslim clothes i dont know how i wwould react)
The fact that combat ready position, is a combat ready position is just allowing me less than a sec to analyse everything and choose to act or not.
Seeing an assault rifle like that even if it s legal, should trigger your situation awareness, no matter if you re afraid of guns or not.
As usual I agree. That was a cute girl though in the first picture from mysanantonio.com. 🙂
regards,
lwk
As a Texan, the aggressive OC folk make cringe. But (see, I’m a butter too!) there is no other way to legally exercise your right to bear arms in Texas without a license, that is, without asking for official permission to do that which is intended to keep officialdom in check– except with a long gun.
I am therefore torn–I’d OC with an unlicensed pistol if the law allowed. It doesn’t so I’m constrained to do with a rifle, if at all. Even though tactically a pistol makes much more sense.
(I do not OC at all, because I’m not in a position yet where I can afford to get busted, and the whole point of unlicensed carry is to not attract official attention.)
I think it’s a good thing to OC over your shoulder, especially at a mass rally. As an individual, I think the point should be to carry as if it were as normal as carrying a back pack–but that means being as discreet as a long gun will let you be.
Somewhere there is a balance, a way to OC a long gun to make a frankly political point, as an act of advocacy and public education, but I can’t quite tell where it is.
Combat-carrying a rifle into a crowded business is far on the wrong side of the line, though.
And keep in mind who we face: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N30TagPCNE4
That video, showing a legal open carry stop in Oregon, has been up for well over a year. It’s got five million comments and is still active. Most of those comments read like they’re reading from a Bloomberg script.
I wish Warren, the carrier, were a little better spoken. I wish he had a little tighter grasp of the law in his area.
I wish I had his balls. I think this is the way to do it: peaceable, polite (for the most part), willing to engage without hostile challenge. On an open, quiet public road (approach to town hall, by the way.)
Officer Estes is also (reasonably) polite, and is indeed a model for this kind of encounter, although obviously I wish he had responded to the “man with a gun” 911 call by driving past, seeing there was no crime in progress, and clearing the call.
Dave i ve seen this video few month ago and i totaly likes the way Estes dealed with the situation, i like the way he stoped aswell Just to be sure of the state of mind of the man.
I m thinking also about the “always cover your ass” rule, Estes could say later he wanna make sure this guy was apparently a regular jo and not someone with some visible mental disorder
A great job anyway
RC, here’s the problem: The cops never know the state of mind of anybody. And in a free society, they can expect to see quite a few people carrying. Openly exercising a basic human right, especially one the state is forbidden to infringe, cannot be used to justify interfering with a citizen peaceably going about his otherwise lawful business. Currently, cops are using possession of a weapon as a proxy for ill intent. As more citizens carry, both open and concealed, cops will have to accustom themselves to accepting that pretty much anyone they meet may well be armed, and yet have no ill intent.
Although Estes handled himself professionally and politely, he should not have stopped Warren & co. in the first place, nor should he have continued the stop once they had demonstrated a peaceable demeanor.
It always makes me a bit nervous when people praise Estes without also praising Warren and company for their bravery in risking their freedom, and their courtesy towards Estes.
Indeed it s really hard to a LE to know the perfect state of mind of anybody, but i assume you’ve already seen some strange people walking on the street acting irrascionally.
Carrying weapon in a crowd area isn t a basic human right, it s maybe a constitutional right in USA, but it s not worldwide i know that’s not the point here but I think it s good to think about 😉
Otherwise, I get your point, but i don t see the problem about Warren just showing his ID card, he was indeed polite and quite a nice man, but the encounter with officer Estes could have been much more pleasant and quick if he just collaborated a bit more.
One last point, i do agree if anyone could just walk around with ar15 on their back without freaking lots of people would be great, the day an assault rifle will be as comon and non scary as a simple back pack would be great, but this day isn t here yet, and as long as active shooters exists i don t see that point coming.
( I Hope i made myself clear enough :))
Great post. I have really been trying to figure these guys out, I think you may have figured out what motivates them.
well said sir….
Thank you, thank you, thank you….. I enjoy my firearms and own several ar’s but the truth is that these tools strutting around at restaurants with their weapons at the ready frightens me. Why you ask? No not because I am afraid of guns as I am ex-military I kinda like em! Lol. No it is because seeing these tactical ninja’s in their flip flops make me wonder if there is a round chambered and what type of training do they have if any? For fuck sake I am with my daughter and yea it concerns me that they will do something stupid while eating their burrito. I really do not know what to make of it except that these guys are trying to stir shit up and look tough and ready for anything. If it was my intention to rob chipotle and steal all the guacamole then I would simply walk up and ……. While they are drinking their diet coke.
It does make all gun people look like extremists and I really do not feel an ar or ak at dinner makes sense. Why do they choose these particular models and not a marlin 30/30 or 12 gauge loaded with some bad ass sabot rounds. Let’s be honest it is to make them feel like they are the shit and that is the reason I do not go to public ranges but have a membership at a private one. I have seen way to many stupid gun owners exercising their 2nd amendment rights while turning with a finger on the trigger.
Sorry for the rant but this shit makes it bad for the rest of us. My wife is not a gun person and she just shakes her head when she sees people doing this. Her response is “these are your fellow gun owners and you wonder why people view gun people as crazies”. I respond that I am not like that and neither are my friends and there are other gun owners who are not like that also”. To this she says “yea but but is those people that get on the news and not you!
Cannot argue with that.
In the last couple years, they’ve found a body, executed, with gang tattoos as well as unauthorized weed crop operations out at the family farm. Needless to say, I OC a rifle there. So does my wife and our teenage son. On our own, family-owned, private acreage. And, I sling it on my back, never combat-ready. Thank you for weighing in on this so thoughtfully.
By your own logic I guess you were a puss because you didn’t run unsupported into a battle? You had 50 other guys with guns shooting back, right? Logic is tough to defend against, huh?
There was an actual threat against us. Do you define combat against armed enemy as cowardice, but walking into a zero-threat Chipotle with 20 AK-armed men as bravery?
No need to answer. I know you consider me a coward. I can live with that. 🙂